Category: Parent Talk
my best friend home schools her 6 year old sun, and I have gotten the privvlage to see the good and bad aspects of this as an outsider. it's really got me to thinking about what my options are and what i'd like to do concerning my son's future.
the bad aspects are that her sun has gotten more and more out of hand as the days go on. not wanting to share his toys, not wanting to listen, not wanting to do his work, wanting to play all day long, and just his hole adatood has gotten worse. I don't think i want my child to end up like that, I really do believe it's because he's not around other kids his age. i think he's lost one of the key ellaments that kids need, interaction, with other kids.
the only good things i get out of this is the fact that she's able to control what her sun is around threw out the day and it gives them alot more bonding time. she teaches him what she wants him to learn and he's exceptionally smart for his age, so she's able to work with him more on his levvle.
I don't think it would be good for my family because, 1, I cannot spell, 2, i really want him to be around other children, and 3, i really don't think I could do it, i mean, moms and kids need brakes.
the only reason the idea even popped in to my head is because I was talking to someone about not givving my son the rest of his vaxinations and they said well you better get ready to home school then. just got me to thinking is all.
so any one got any thoughts, views, opinions?
why or why shouldn't we home school, and what are your pros and cons?
gosh, i feel like i'm monopolizing this board today. i promise i'll shut up after this email. home schooling is a fascinating subject. unlike most people I won't advocate for either side.
i home schooled both my kids in middle school and high school. my daughter is blind and my son has normal vision. the reasons we did this are many. the school system where we live is the poorest in our state. it is filled with gangs, and all kinds of racial stuff. my daughter was getting ridiculed terribly. kids are far meaner today then back in my youth.
when i had a child in the 5th grade ask me what state london was the capital of, it gave me an idea that maybe they weren't learning too awfully much. when i received report cards and the teacher's comments were riddled with basic spelling errors I became concerned.
i would not have taught a sighted child to read. my son went to a private school for his formative years. then we transferred him to public. the elementary schools in my neighborhood are ok. not great, but definitely a cut above the middle and high schools.
it depends on what we want our kids to get out of schooling. nowadays where i live all the emphasis is on passing tests. stuffing the head full of sfacts to pass a standardized exam is not learning. a as aristotle so eloquently stated, "a mind is not a bowl to be filled but a fire to be lighted." thank goodness in my daughter's case, working at her own pace established and encouraged the love of knowledge. on her own she attended school all year and graduated a year early.
my son liked home schooling but is not a book kind of guy. he loves to work with his hands. he attended senior year in a small town and lived with a relative. he loved the school but was not impressed with the learning. here is a funny story. in history they were studying the viet nam war. he failed the test, which was surprising since he was fascinated with that subject which we had just finished at home. when he got his grade, this quiet self efacing young man went to his teacher and protested the grade. he said "in home schooling we learned why things happened not just the date the occurred." they teacher said ok, explain the factors surrounding the tet offensive. after 10 minutes of listening to my son, he said "you got an a now get out of here."
socialization is a myth. most home schoolers join with other families to work together attend field trips etc. this is more natural as kids of all ages work and play together. i could go on and on but let me know if you have any questions.
Hmmm! Cotton wool kids comes to mind here, those bloody ridiculous parents, sorry if I offend anyone here, but ya know, those parents who won't let 'em half an inch past their own front door or front gate someone might take 'em away, haahaa, someone'll take ya away. Get over it! Doesn't happen every day and my kids'll be allowed to go anywhere they blimming well want, so long as they're sensible and they've taken in the advice about not going anywhere with anybody unless I know or trust the person they go off with myself. Home Schooling's never been tried or tested here in my family, nor will it start, ever! My children'll form a closeknit group at the front gate every morning, when I'll kick off a School train with other vollunteer parents willing to walk their own children to School along with mine, therefore, first tastes of interaction for those who're just starting, a lot more awareness of road safety as well as fun and even mini nature trails along the way, picking up litter in bin bags, helping make them aware of how to make for a cleaner Great Britain, like what I used to do with my peer groups in Brownies and Guides as part of nearly every session, where we'd do likewise round the local churchyard, down the roads, even in people's gardens where we spotted say, empty coke cans and sweet wrappers floating about, all would be collected in to a binbag and disposed of appropriately by the pack leaders later on and the nature trails, where we'd also, go out and be allowed to wander and find bits and bobs for creating various natural works of art. We collected all that stuff in empty raisins boxes, smarty tubes or any other suitably large plastic or cardboard containers, so, back on topic, the walk to School doesn't have to be both trying and boring. I'd turn it in to an early morning environmental awareness adventure. Why not?
As for coming home, my only request would be that the kids contacted me at home or on the mobile or even via Email to tell me if they had a School activity they wanted to participate in after School's out. Most of the time, naturally, since the last thing I'd want is an almost, totally cut off and sheltered upbringing like my own for my children, I'd almost certainly, say a resounding yes, providing, I met up with whomever ran or organised the club, activity or outing my children wanted to go on or participate in, first, so I would be reassured then, that my children would walk in the door as soon as possible after the activity finished, having walked or got a bus or cab home with me or a lift from another known and trusted parent, maybe one of those who participates in the School trains in the mornings, just so I knew they were safely, out of harm's way. Other than these very, few and far between safety precautions for my children, they would never be homeschooled. I feel that's just too unfair on any child to have this treatment when all they did was come in to the world a few short years before and they wouldn't know where to start bless them, if their parents were to leave it too long before letting them loose on other children or other children loose on them in a social situation like for example, a youth club or some other outing. There's also keeping up with peers of their own age to consider as well. I wouldn't want my children falling behind in anything, a repetition of my own Schooling, I'd want them in the middle or even the top sets in class and I'd want them to feel acceptionally confident and independent of me or their father, from an acceptionally early age, say, 2 and a half, 3 years old, so they'd find the confidence to be one of the best if at all possible. I just don't see how homeschooling any child in this world today, let's them be who they want to be, let's them grow, let's them find themselves, I really don't.
Jen.
hedwig
things are a lot different in britain then in this country re education. i agree there are loonie toons who home school just as there are whackos who put their kids in public school.
i worked full time, so my kids had to have the discipline to get their courses done. I had a schedule which was distributed to them. if their goals were not met, consequences occured. they knew that when I got home, i would check and grade what they had done and answer their questions. additionally they had to learn to get along together, to work cooperatively and so forth.
my kids took public transportation independently to attend classes offered by the community and by the home school cooops in my area. both had cell phones and I was in contact with the schools.
Maybe I am blessed with unusual kids, but they rose to the challenge. both of them have done outstandingly if i say so myself. they were expected to act responsively and responsibly and they did.
My neighbors homeschool their kids, and although the kids are really smart and way ahead academically, they're behind socially and, like the original poster mentioned, out of control.
For us Europeans it's hard to get used to the notion that some schools are downright dangerous and the quality of them is so awful that the child might be better of at home. One of my biggest surprises when Googling facts to consider when buying your first home in the U.S. was the school district and its importance. Good school district can up the value ofyour home significantly. The other thing I agree with Turricane on is the over importance people give to academic learning. I have at lest two friends who just kept struggling in school, even if they are smart guys, and finally gave it up and went for plumbing and electrician jobs. Both did extremely well and have pretty decent jobs today, heck they get to get out and about and get a bit of a work out, and they used to get paid very well before the economic downturn but, heck, I lost my job in it too so it's not as if I fared better. This is a very difficult option for a blind kid though, since we're not exactly the most appropriate apprentices for hair cuttery, bus driving or plumbing, but who knows, if you tried to make a career out of plumbing somehow, may be you could find a niche. I know of a very successful blind real estate agent.
My question is, is there any quality control or mandatory consultation for parents who home school their kids, isthere an official school plan they can follow and exams the kids can take, other than the SATs to measure their progress compared to their peers?
That being said, I still stick to my main 3 reasons why I would think home schooling is generally a bad idea:
Social development and living and dealing with peers. This may be overcome by parent support groups but thehomeschooling parent wouldhave to be interested enough to seek one out, and parents would have to co ordinate work groups to allow kids to solve problems as a team etc.
Qualification: I do not think I could educate my boys half as well as a person dedicated and paid to do it with a multi billion dollar system behind him/her, with specialist that could advice me of problems with my kids. I'd be more than happy to help, with homework, finding solutions to the problems, but I know I just would not do as good as job. Of course this is given tat the teacher can spell and add 2 and 2.
Finally, for myself, I just need time and career for myself and know I make a better daddy if I get half a day to 8 hours of doing my own thing.
I do not believe it's healthy or right to send one's kid to day care at 4 or 6 weeks,ifit can be avoided, and I think they should stay home and bond until their 12 to 18 months old. But after that I feel the kid is better off learning to cope with peers.
Of course there are home schoolingparents who really dedicate themselves and can both have enough knowledge and discipline to make this work, but my main concern is the complete lack of standards or requirements that home schooling seems to allow (and I may simply be wrong there), and the one sided world view the kid could take away. The parents won't always be there for their children so it's important they can acquire the skills and knowledge mecessary to manage.
ell, I have two cousins, brother and sister, still, very nice, well mannered brother and sister in fact, age 15 and 17. They both went to Secondary School in quite a rough area of Hampshire here in the UK. That does not under any circumstances mean, they automatically turned to gang culture because they were Schooled in a somewhat rough area. They were brought up to know what was acceptable behaviour and what was totally unacceptable behaviour, so even if there was gang culture and shit happening all round them, they just wouldn't get involved in that. Joe has now left this School and he spent last year studdying for his A and AS levels at Alton College, same area where this Secondary School his younger sister still atends is. Now, neither, of these children would for example, walk up to you now and knife you for wandering in to their postcode. They'd actually, want to be everybody's friend. They're that laid back for a 15-year-old and a 17-year-old, so mature for their ages that you wouldn't know they spent the last few years of their lives surrounded by a fair amount of gang culture and violence. In fact, my whole, family, would never, live in places like London, Luton, even parts of Nottingham, Essex, Yorkshire, Merseyside, just a few example of rough areas in the UK. None of us would go there, well, with the acception of perhaps me, looking to move up to Nottingham with my own close circle of friends, lol. If any area is rough and we think it wouldn't be good for the kids education or our own health, well, like when my mum was a tiny tot, two years of age, my Grandparents packed up and left Ilford in Essex, their first home, because it wasn't the environment they wanted to bring the children up in. OK, we spent years after that, living on the outskirts of West London, but the village where my Grandparents spent a lot of their married life, right up until I was 10 in fact, 15 years ago, was one of the safest places about 5 miles drive from London as you could wish for. My point being? There's no reason for anyone to reside in a rough area where the kids are trapped at home even for their Schooling, there really isn't. You feel the surroundings aren't a good environment to bring them up and educate them in, well, simply, get the hell out while the going's good, like we did 50 years ago this year. Maybe easier said than done for some though, but at least, think on it.
Jen.
hedwig,
i'm not saying that my kids would have become members of a gang because they exist. in the middle school near here, there are at least one incident a week where a child is taken to the er because of uncontrolled agression. my kid could be in the wrong place and bango. sorry if i gave that impression.
good for you for having parents who have the means to move. not all of us are financially able to do so.
to give you an example of my concerns, in my area there are two middle schools. due to some troll's stupidity, the books for both of them were sent to one. i kid you not. so by the time they figured this out and fixed the problem, the kids in the school without the books had been through a month of watching disney movies all day.
the school with two sets didn't want to give them back because they had passed them out so the students could have a set at home and one in the classroom.
wildebrew, in my state, a child is required to submit an education plan either to an umbrella organization or to the county where they live. an umbrella organization is approved by the state to oversee home schooling. every year, the child's work is reviewed by someone from either the county or the umbrella. additionally the iowa or standard achievement tests are given in most of these groups once a year.
oh as for the out of control home schoolers. that's a piss poor parenting problem. no matter where those darlings get their education, they'd probably still be little monsters.
Oo dear, in answer to post 8, the family kind of has to have the work ethic genes to kick start us off at the tender age of 14, when one of my mum's nieces also my cousin had work experience which then turned in to paid shift work down a local riding stables, mum started out as a babysitter for the neighbours, later going on to train as a nurse and quallify as a midwife, delivering the grand total of 58 babies then looking after some of the very premature infants in the NICU, during the 10 years she worked at our local hospital when I was little before we moved away later on. After the nursing, she moved on to Admin and Personel work with various companies over the period of about 20 years since I started School. My Grandparents, when they first decided to have children lived in essex as that's where Gran's mum and dad lived until her mum died at just 52 in a diabetic coma when mum was just a year old. A year later, they moved to a safer environment, more suited to bringing up a young family. Gran at that time, worked as a typist and personal secretary for a firm of sollicitors then Chub Fire, famous for its deadlocks and fire extinguishers, while Grandad quallified as an electrician, computer technitian and engineer, so with all this under their belts of course, there's really no shortage of money whatever our circumstances. My Aunt, works from home so she can bring in the money, also as a personal secretary to a fairly well off couple who live in the same village where we used to live, then as a fairly sizable bit on the side and as a second stay at home mum job, she's the editor of this local tourist info guide and good food guide in one for a nearby local town. I even get a look in here, as I babysit for her on the move, while she goes out and delivers these guides down town while I keep an eye on the baby in the car for a maximum £20 for 3 hours, usually, every 4 weeks or so unless she finds another willing vollunteer. That's probably the best I can hope for sadly, till I can get out of Surrey, till mum let's me lay so much as a fingernail on a nice fat checque from my savings so I can at least try and rent somewhere up near my own close circle of mates where I'd almost certainly, get a 50 50 chance of being able to work for anybody. Surrey is so anti-disability in the workplace, you wouldn't believe!
Jen.
hedwig, although i am probably misreading it, the tone of your message implies that i'm lazy for not having the means to move. i'm sure you are proud of your parents and rightly so. we each have our own priorities and our own areas we find important.
for the record i grew up in a working class area. we could have owned a great house, but my folks loved travel. so the money we would have spent on a huge home and the latest car went for fantastic vacations. by the age of 21 among other things i had been across the us twice and to europe two times as well.
i started working at age 12 and thankgod am still doing so today. I don't tell this often because it sounds like bragging.
both my husband and I are blind. it is a sad fact that for whatever reason many of us don't advance as far or as fast as sighted individuals do.
With the way housing prices have risen in the dc area, i could pay more and get less. Additionally in a richer county, things like food, restaurants, and movies are higher.
for me it's better to have public transportation close by and to have my kids experience the different cultures in our extremely diverse neighborhood. where i live is very low in crime but the other towns from which our middle and high schools feed are not.
I respect your beliefs that the public eduaction route is the best for you and your future family to take. Please extend the same towards me.
back on the topic here. schooling is something that i am already thinking about, even though savannah is only 10 months old. I flat out refuse to put her into the public school system where i am currently living. idealy, I would love to move back home to small town life, but well i'll have to find a job that would allow me to do so. i recieved my education there, and i think it was fairly decent. there were honors classes for those that wanted them. there were plenty of opportunities for extra curricular activities that she wouldn't have in a big city. the classes are small. the school is small. and when i went there, the teachers were excellent. i still have family that goes there and an aunt that teaches there. there aren't the gangs and ghetto children that have invaded our public schools here.
if i can't make moving back home work, savannah will either attend catholic school here in topeka, or she will be home schooled. i believe that i want her in catholic school over me home schooling her. i'm not an ignorant person, but i want to make sure she gets a great education. and i'm not sure that is something i could provide totally for her. hell i can't even write real sentences in this post. lol
i think both have their pros and cons. and the socialization with other students, if she were home schooled, is one of the first things i made sure happened. i know a woman who was home schooled, and well she is socially retarded and set in her ways that adapting now as an adult isn't going to happen.
Turricane, very interesting on the tests. Do you know what happens if a child fails the tests, are the parents held responsible in any way or given additional training or counselling to improve the schooling (of course sometimes the child may just be slow or have learning difficulties but sometimes I am sure home schooling is horribly inadequate, it all depends on the parent).
Also, how did you approach subjects that needed a lot of visualization, drawing, learning hand writing, visual way of doing math, colors etc (I guess you didn't home school very young kids so you didn't have to deal with that as much). I'd be very worried that I'd be ignoring the child's sight, though I think, often, that non visual means of learning can be better and schools are super over reliant on visual clues and pictures to teach kids.
I mean, another problem for blind parents is how to pcik up the kid or deliver him or her to school, if the public transportation system is lacking in the area such a thing may simply not be possible. There are the school busses I guess, but I don't know if they run for every school or how that system works.
very interesting questions wildebrew. i would have felt extremely inadequate to teach a sighted child reading. My family has autism in it, so wanted to make sure that if my son had it it was caught and that a pro did what i felt inadequate to attempt.
i did teach our blind daughter braille or helped with the school as even though they had a vision teacher it was woefully inadequate.
home schooling has all kinds of curriculum mapped out. A family can chose anything from booklets with subjects and excercises that the child fills in to computerized instruction, to regular classroom type books. basically you can be as conformed to one that fits your style or make one up as you go along.
in order to graduate with a diploma each state has certain criteria which must be met. therefore, it is up to the parent and/or any school to make sure this is done.
for example, in maryland, you either have to get two language credits or two technology credits. both my kids chose the latter.
for a subject i felt inadequate to teach, i learned right along with them. the one that really sticks out in my mind is algebra. i didn't do well the first time back in the day. keeping ahead really helped me to grasp it.
the whole issue of standardized tests is a thorny one. many parents choose not to do them. they figure they have a pretty good handle on their kids and their ability. others take them every year. depending on the state in which you reside there is a lot of lattitude and personal choice. if a child does poorly, it is up to the parent to address the issue. i always viewed them as a guide to show where i was doing ok and where we needed help.
as for art my friend robin and i worked out a deal. her son seth and my michael were best friends. so,on monday nights, seth would come over to my house eat dinner and we'd do the science experiments. then we'd watch wrestling and he'd go home. on thursday nights michael would go to seths do art and then they'd watch wrestling and come home. no tv if they didn't do their stuff. i loved doing the experiments with them. robin is extremely tallented in the art world and creative she hates all that boring messy science stuff. so we both did fine.
advantage of homeschool: you got to control exactly what they recieve knowledge, how they recieve, when, where, how many hours, etc etc.
disadvantage: the kid won't have the socialize skills that is require in the moddern society, poor problem solving skills, often have anti social behavior, lack of classroom experience, etc etc.
season, you are painting with a pretty broad brush. most home school kids I know have more maturity and responsibility then the average bear. many work and attend school. several i know take high school and college concurrently. many do their work because thy want to do so. i have seen the misfits and geeks, but by far they are the minority in my experience. i find it ironic that we as blind people who are aware of the damage that stereotyping has make these opinion statements disguised as facts about another group of people who are a minority. i know a guy, named joe who is the first person i am aware of who was home schooled. his mom and dad did this back in the 80s when this was considered radical indeed. at age 13 he graduated from school. he passed the entrance exams for several colleges, but his parents required that he work in the family business until he was the appropriate age to attend university. at the appropriate time he did so and double majored in electrical engineering and computer science. at 35 he is a high grade federal employee who supervises like 30 people most of whom are older then is he. he is extremely bright and would have excelled wherever he would have gone to school. on the other end of the spectrum, i know a girl who is 20. she has the personality of a wet noodle. she dresses like a grandma and you can't hold a conversation with her. of course her parents are just like her. i would say the the population of home schoolers is like the average of america. there are blacks, whites, asians and hispanics as well as us whites. there are smart dumb, hoods, artistic types, and you name it. for me the beauty part of the process is that our children can learn in the way that fits them beest and can explore and experience outside the realm of a prescribed curiculum. hope i'm making sense